Great Lakes OOTP

Al Borie submitted an idea for discussion. Please make your preferences known. Thanks

The idea is simple: re-align the minor leagues. Have one league at each level for GMs who don't want to manage their minor leagues, and one level at each league for those who do. I don't care if someone has 7 players on their team if it doesn't effect me; I only care if it does. If my minor league teams could be in leagues where the other teams were not artificially deflating my minor leaguers' statistics, I could easily tolerate the existence of a Jim Unknown league that I am not a part of.

Not a fan. We're one league, with one league division.

The Keep It Simple principle applies here. Either ghosties on or off, simple IMO, and then every GM plays within that dynamic. If some choose not to fill their minors that's their problem. If, as has been mentioned, 6 teams are filling their minors and two aren't the stats from player the Jim Unknowns won't have that much of an impact, also as every team plays each other the stats between minor league players at the same level will be relative so it's still easy to see who is performing well relative to the level they're playing at.

Nope, not a fan at all.

The GLBL has two levels of minors.
Frankly I would rather have at least another, but that is an entirely different discussion, so will leave it alone.

The task of making sure they are filled could not be simpler. So...make sure you have a full roster at both.

As I think of the reality of the separation of minors by criteria...it does create a have/have not atmosphere. Reminds of the DH and No DH leagues. My preference is to manage baseball issues in such a way that it doesn't create imbalance. With that in mind you may be able to come up with ideas/preferences that can satisfy multiple points of view while maintaining a common and shared environment for all teams.

btw...I wrote the above before reading any of the comments. That was fast.

milwaukee_mike wrote:If some choose not to fill their minors that's their problem...6 teams are filling their minors and two aren't the stats from player the Jim Unknowns won't have that much of an impact...

I don't agree. In a six-team league, I play five other teams. If two of them are made up largely of Jim Unknowns, that's 40% of my competition. That has a significant impact on my players' stats. It then becomes my problem too.

milwaukee_mike wrote:also as every team plays each other the stats between minor league players at the same level will be relative so it's still easy to see who is performing well relative to the level they're playing at.

.

Yes and no. Again, the small size of the league enhances the impact of any anomaly. A Jim Unknown team doesn't play against itself, so in a 6-team league with four real teams and two mostly-Jim Unknown teams, those Jim Unknown teams face 20% fewer Jim Unknowns than I do. This further skews the stats of their real players.

David-J wrote:The task of making sure they are filled could not be simpler. So...make sure you have a full roster at both.

Yeah, you'd think so. The task has proven extraordinarily difficult for some.

My do-it-one-way-in-one-league-and-another-way-in-the-other plan is not my first choice. It's an attempt at compromise. My first choice would be to have a set of rules that everyone follows, even if they're not 100% in favor of them.

Our minor leagues have been problematic from the get-go, and they remain so even after a series of seemingly annual compromises by Steve. Initially Steve announced there were to be no ghost players, and an age limit at AA. After the inaugural draft it was discovered that so few GMs had bothered to comply with the age limit that it was deemed necessary to temporarily allow ghost players. Then Steve announced a two-year grace period for complying with the age requirement. After the two years were up, there were still GMs who couldn't fill their AA teams with age-eligible players. So then he waived the age requirement, making it as easy as it could possibly be for each GM to fill both of his minor league rosters. And we STILL have GMs refusing to do it.

commish wrote:My preference is to manage baseball issues in such a way that it doesn't create imbalance. With that in mind you may be able to come up with ideas/preferences that can satisfy multiple points of view while maintaining a common and shared environment for all teams.

Yeah, I dig. Unfortunately when there are rules that only some people think they have to follow, it creates an imbalance.

Here's another proposal: abolish the minor leagues, and use the Reserve Roster system. It's not as fun or as interesting to those of us who like to manage our minor league systems, but at least it's honest. If there are teams who are nominally a part of a minor league, but not really participating in it, then we don't really have a minor league. I like having minor leagues, but I'd rather have no minor league than a half-assed minor league.

What exactly is the issue with your guys (or my guys) getting stats against Jim Unknown players? They're still playing baseball, and still gaining experience.

There must be an impact i'm unaware of. From the tone of the response driving this discussion, is Mr J.U. a far better player than those with more unique names (i.e. real players)?

milwaukee_mike wrote:There must be an impact i'm unaware of. From the tone of the response driving this discussion, is Mr J.U. a far better player than those with more unique names (i.e. real players)?

YES. Absolutely without question, YES. I've been posting stats to that effect for three seasons. Unfortunately the minor league stats in this league apparently go away after the season ends (hate that) but I can show you an example from the current season.

http://www.greatlakesootp.com/reports/n ... s_0_1.html

As you can see (If you check the link before too many more games are played), the Golden Eagles have one excellent starter (Stinson), one pretty good starter (Munson), a reliever who's been pretty bad (Snider), and pretty much nothing else, just a few guys who have thrown between 1.0 and 5.2 innings in relief. The two starters have 13 starts between them, and the Golden Eagles have played 97 games. So that's 84 out of 97 games started by Jim Unknowns, plus God knows how many Jim Unknown relief appearances.

They're 2nd in the league in ERA, and 2nd in WHIP. They give up half a run a game less than four other teams in the six-team league. So yes, Jim Unknown is certainly a better pitcher than most of the guys with more colorful names.

I could have shown you even more extreme examples from years past, but the stats are gone (unless Steve has been archiving them). If you want to take my word for it, there were teams that had hardly any real pitchers or real hitters, but who dominated their leagues with their Jim Unknowns.

No realignment. Topic now locked. Thanks